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-   -   Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling (http://netcookingtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18614)

lilbopeep 05-21-2011 11:09 PM

Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
1 Attachment(s)
This Letís Talk will focus on a method of cooking. Please share your tips, techniques and secrets to success. Pictures and recipes are optional but always welcome.


Attachment 23717

lilbopeep 05-22-2011 12:32 AM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
I like to use a combo of mesquite and hickory chips when I grill. I am no expert in this subject. I would love to learn how to smoke foods on my basic no frills (charcoal not gas) weber grill.

Guts 05-22-2011 11:55 AM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
here is one that I did a while back. They came out pretty good. You just have to remember to cut across grain.

http://netcookingtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18057

Cooksie 05-22-2011 05:31 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Having a charcoal chimney is really nice. It makes lighting those briquettes so much easier.

loboloco 05-22-2011 07:58 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
If smoking or wanting smoke flavor, I generally use mesquite or hickory. I never use starter fluids, but start the fire with kindling or 'lighter'. I would like to have a good chimney, and my brother, when he has time is going to make me one from Stainless Steel.

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 02:08 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Thank you Keltin and Lee!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keltin (Post 231732)
I wouldn't pre-cook the chicken. There are many "tricks" you can do on the grill to avoid a flare-up.

What kind of grill do you have?

If it is a kettle style (domed lid & curved body), those are designed to eliminate flare-ups if the lid is kept on. The design funnels air through a lower vent and up to the top vent in such as fashion as to allow the coals to stay lit, but to retard flare ups. You only get flare-ups when you pull the lid off and more oxygen rushes in.

To ensure you don't get flares ups, reduce your coal count. For an 18" to 22" kettle, count out 55 coals and use just that many. Spread them out in a circular pattern - kind of like a doughnut with a small space in the center of the grill that is blank or is the "hole" of the doughnut. Keep the lid on the grill at all times except when flipping or saucing the chicken.

If you have a square type grill, then put all of your coals on one side, and leave and open spot on the other. So all the coals would be on the left, and on the right would be a blank spot with no coals. Put your chicken on bone side down above the coals for 5 minutes. Flip to skin side down for 5 minutes. Then flip again and move it all to the right where there are no coals and let it sit for 15-20 minutes - by now the coals are low enough that flare-ups won't be a [problem, and the chicken is about 3/5 of the way done. Now move the chicken back over the coals and finish grilling, making sure to flip every 6 or so minutes.

If it is a gas grill, hopefully it has two burners. Turn on the left burner and leave the right one off. Let the grill heat up covered for 10 minutes. Put the chicken on, boneside down over the lit burner. Flip after 5 minutes and cook another 5 minutes. Now flip again and move the chicken to the right side where the burner is off. Close the lid and let it sit 15-20 minutes. Now finish grilling and saucing over the lit burner. by this time, the chicken is 3/5 of the way done, and most of the fat that would cause a flare-up has been rendered out.

Alternatively, no matter what grill you have, just put all the coals on one side, and leave the other side open. Start by putting all the chicken on the side that has no coals (or no lit burner). Close the lid, and position the vent (on a kettle style grill) so it is above the chicken. Now walk away and leave the chicken alone for 25 minutes. This will basically smoke the chicken and render out the fat. Now spend 10 - 15 minutes grilling and saucing the chicken directly over the coals which should be cool enough now that flare-ups won't be a problem at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by QSis (Post 231734)
I agree with Keltin about not pre-cooking the chicken, if you can avoid it.

For one thing, it defeats the purpose of not heating up the house. For another thing, poaching will leave some flavor in the water, and baking may dry out the chicken. In either case, double-cooking might dry out the chicken.

Two suggestions: One is what Keltin suggested, cooking the chicken most of the way, using the indirect method (placing the pieces over the part of the grill that does not have a heat source directly underneath it). When the chicken is almost done, move the pieces directly over the heat source and grill them off.

Another way has become popular with competitive barbecuers: Place the pieces in a disposable foil pan and pour in barbecue sauce until it comes about halfway up the sides of the chicken. Season the skin with rub. Some people brush a little sauce on the skin, some do not. Poach the chicken on the grill, until it's just about done. Then take the pieces out and place them over the fire BRIEFLY, with the lid up, to blacken them a bit. DO NOT WALK AWAY, as the sauce will burn quickly. Done correctly, this yields a fall-off the bone chicken with a deep flavor of the sauce and nicely grilled/blackened skin.

Lee


lilbopeep 05-27-2011 02:13 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
1 Attachment(s)
OK I have a smoke chip box. Where, when and how should I place it? I soak the chips for at least 1/2 hour but the last time they still caught fire.

Keltin 05-27-2011 02:32 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
I couldn't see the pic of your grill in the other thread. Can you post an amazon link of a similar grill?

If it's a coal grill, place that box directly on the coals off to one side or the other.

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 03:04 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
1 Attachment(s)
Can you see this?

Attachment 23718

Keltin 05-27-2011 03:16 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by lilbopeep (Post 231755)
Can you see this?
Attachment 23719

Not here. Photo sites are blocked here, only attachments work. A link to Amazon would work as well.

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 03:39 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
This is pissing me off!! Why won't this picture I scanned upload as an attachment!!

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 03:45 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Amazon Amazon

Keltin 05-27-2011 03:50 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Sweet! It's a Weber Kettle. Mighty fine grill!!!

When you spread your coals, push a few extra to the side or back (against the wall of the grill) to make a "bed" for the smoker box. Place the box directly on the coals of that "bed". Make sure to put the lid on the box to keep the chips from bursting into flames.

When you put the lid on the grill, position the lid vent directly opposite the smoker box. this cause the smoke to rise from the box, travel across the grill and then out the vent for max smoke. If you have the vent above the box, the smoke will go straight up and out. You'll still get some smoke flavor, but not as much.

If you don't have the lid that should have come with that box, the put aluminum foil over the top and poke 3 holes in the foil.

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 03:52 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
1 Attachment(s)
Ok did this work?

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 03:55 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Keltin (Post 231760)
Sweet! It's a Weber Kettle. Mighty fine grill!!!

When you spread your coals, push a few extra to the side or back (against the wall of the grill) to make a "bed" for the smoker box. Place the box directly on the coals of that "bed". Make sure to put the lid on the box to keep the chips from bursting into flames.

When you put the lid on the grill, position the lid vent directly opposite the smoker box. this cause the smoke to rise from the box, travel across the grill and then out the vent for max smoke. If you have the vent above the box, the smoke will go straight up and out. You'll still get some smoke flavor, but not as much.

If you don't have the lid that should have come with that box, the put aluminum foil over the top and poke 3 holes in the foil.

The smoke box didn't come with a lid.

Keltin 05-27-2011 04:12 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
That last attachment worked!

You can use aluminum foil to make a lid. In fact, you can use aluminum foil period. Just put your chips on some foil. Wrap it up tight. Poke 3 holes in the top, and lay the foil pack on the coils.

Keltin 05-27-2011 04:32 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Here's a guy that has done a lot of good smoking on a Weber Kettle. He used a bit too much fuel (coals) in this loin smoke (and he admits as much), but the idea is clearly conveyed. Coals on the sides, drip pan in the middle, meat above the pan. Reduce the amount of coals a bit, and you've got the makings of a perfect smoke. Ribs work well this way.

http://www.glenncrowe.com/BBQ/Weber_Kettle_Pork_Loin/Ndx.html

From that page, go to the BBQ Gallery, and check out his ingenious 5 brick Kettle! I'm so doing that soon!! Or just click the link below.

http://www.glenncrowe.com/BBQ/5BK/Ndx.html

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 04:35 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
I never use a drip pan. Do I need to?

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 04:37 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
I don't have a chimney either

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 04:42 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Keltin (Post 231768)
Here's a guy that has done a lot of good smoking on a Weber Kettle. He used a bit too much fuel (coals) in this loin smoke (and he admits as much), but the idea is clearly conveyed. Coals on the sides, drip pan in the middle, meat above the pan. Reduce the amount of coals a bit, and you've got the makings of a perfect smoke. Ribs work well this way.

http://www.glenncrowe.com/BBQ/Weber_Kettle_Pork_Loin/Ndx.html

From that page, go to the BBQ Gallery, and check out his ingenious 5 brick Kettle! I'm so doing that soon!! Or just click the link below.

http://www.glenncrowe.com/BBQ/5BK/Ndx.html

OK I have no clue. Lump? How do you light that?

YIKES You need to count the number of coals? Hub just pours a pile of coals in the middle, lights it with lighter fluid, waits for it to ash and barely spreads them then puts whatever over the coals. I need a BIG helping walk through!! WOW. Or maybe I should stick to my stove and oven. LOL

Keltin 05-27-2011 04:57 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lilbopeep (Post 231771)
OK I have no clue. Lump? How do you light that?

YIKES You need to count the number of coals? Hub just pours a pile of coals in the middle, lights it with lighter fluid, waits for it to ash and barely spreads them then puts whatever over the coals. I need a BIG helping walk through!! WOW. Or maybe I should stick to my stove and oven. LOL


Lump is partially burned wood. Black, burned up pieces of would. Almost crystalline. You light lump the same way you light briquettes, but lump burns hotter and faster. however, since it is real wood and not a pressed carbon product like briquettes, it has more flavor.

Yeah, to be precise, counting the number of coals can be important. For instance, in my 18" kettle, 40 cools gives me an internal temp of 350-365 degrees. If I put 80 colas in there, the temp would be around 500 degrees. Think of the grill like you do your oven. if the recipe calls for you to bake at 350 degrees, you wouldn't throw it in a 500 degree oven right?

The more coals you use, the hotter the fire, and the more likely the flare-up.

For basic grilling, you don't have to count. Just use enough to cover the charcoal grate. Spread the coals so that they are all flat and only 1 layer thick (not piled up on each other) and they are all touching each other. That's enough coals for grilling, and you can eyeball that.

For smoking, you really need to think more about internal temp and coal count.

here is some lump coal that is really good.

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=lump+charcoal&hl=en&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=5054132993780970530&sa=X&ei=2g7gTd6 FC9S3tgeS7Mz2CQ&ved=0CHUQ8wIwAQ#

Also, Publix sells their store brand (Publix Brand) lump for 6.99 for a 17# bag, and it burns great. Although you do get the occasional huge deck board piece in there! :lol:

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 05:23 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Keltin (Post 231772)
Lump is partially burned wood. Black, burned up pieces of would. Almost crystalline. You light lump the same way you light briquettes, but lump burns hotter and faster. however, since it is real wood and not a pressed carbon product like briquettes, it has more flavor.

Yeah, to be precise, counting the number of coals can be important. For instance, in my 18" kettle, 40 cools gives me an internal temp of 350-365 degrees. If I put 80 colas in there, the temp would be around 500 degrees. Think of the grill like you do your oven. if the recipe calls for you to bake at 350 degrees, you wouldn't throw it in a 500 degree oven right?

The more coals you use, the hotter the fire, and the more likely the flare-up.

For basic grilling, you don't have to count. Just use enough to cover the charcoal grate. Spread the coals so that they are all flat and only 1 layer thick (not piled up on each other) and they are all touching each other. That's enough coals for grilling, and you can eyeball that.

For smoking, you really need to think more about internal temp and coal count.

here is some lump coal that is really good.

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=lump+charcoal&hl=en&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=5054132993780970530&sa=X&ei=2g7gTd6 FC9S3tgeS7Mz2CQ&ved=0CHUQ8wIwAQ#

Also, Publix sells their store brand (Publix Brand) lump for 6.99 for a 17# bag, and it burns great. Although you do get the occasional huge deck board piece in there! :lol:

OK so I want to smoke the chicken (I will cover raw pieces with rub and allow to sit how many hours in fridge? Or overnight if all works out , overnight is better right?). So how many coals for smoking - count or single layer? After I count or spread single layer do I pile up and light then spread after they ash? And then follow the directions in the above posts by you and Lee? THANK YOU AGAIN.

Keltin 05-27-2011 05:45 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
I don't think what you're looking to do is smoke the chicken. That is good, but leads to rubbery skin. I think what you're wanting is basic grilled chicken?

To avoid flare-ups, do a mixture of offset cooking and direct grilling. It's kind of like smoking, but hotter and faster.

Personally, I think you ought to try Lee's way. It's an awesome technique that should win you some great accolades from the crowd. Heck, I think I may be doing it myself this weekend as well.

For the rub, at least 4 hours in the fridge is the typical target. Overnight is good if possible, but 4 hours is fine.

And honestly, you can still make great chicken without letting it sit. If you use Lee's method, you don't even need the rub since you'll be poaching the chicken in the sauce.

If you want to try my method and start the chicken offset (no coals under it) for 20 minutes, then yeah, the rub is good. At least 2 hours, 4 hours is better, overnight is the bomb.

If you have a chimney, use 3/4 of a stack.

If not, then pour your unlit coals into the grill and spread them out by hand into the shape they'll be in when you grill. In your case, they should all be on the left side with a clear spot on the right side. That is a great way to see how many coals you need.

Next, stack all the coals in the middle of the grill, try to get them in a pyramid shape. Squirt with lighter fluid, then light them. once they ash over, use long tongs to move the lit coals back to the left side (an oven mitt on your hand really helps with this part, but be careful - I've burned many an oven mitt in my day! :lol:). You can stack the lit coals a bit, but remember, at the end you will be grilling the chicken directly, so they need to be spread out a bit so you have some surface area to cook over.


Make sense?

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 06:07 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
I don't have a chimney and I am not looking for raves from a crowd. I have 4 people in my family that are not impressed by anything. (Sorry having issues with my girl at the moment). I just want to grill some chicken with my homemade BBQ sauce. I only make a small amount which will also be used for the beans. So I don't think I will do the poaching method. I am also going to make dogs, burgers and steak along the way so I want to use chips because I like the flavor and they don't care one way or the other.

Sorry I don't mean to sound snotty just been getting crap for about an hour now and I am about up to my to crap quota for the day. Please forgive if I have offended. I APPRECIATE the help and at this point I may just cook for myself and the heck with them!! LOL

lilbopeep 05-27-2011 06:16 PM

Re: Let's Talk ... BBQ, Smoking and Grilling
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Keltin (Post 231776)
I don't think what you're looking to do is smoke the chicken. That is good, but leads to rubbery skin. I think what you're wanting is basic grilled chicken?

To avoid flare-ups, do a mixture of offset cooking and direct grilling. It's kind of like smoking, but hotter and faster.

Personally, I think you ought to try Lee's way. It's an awesome technique that should win you some great accolades from the crowd. Heck, I think I may be doing it myself this weekend as well.

For the rub, at least 4 hours in the fridge is the typical target. Overnight is good if possible, but 4 hours is fine.

And honestly, you can still make great chicken without letting it sit. If you use Lee's method, you don't even need the rub since you'll be poaching the chicken in the sauce.

If you want to try my method and start the chicken offset (no coals under it) for 20 minutes, then yeah, the rub is good. At least 2 hours, 4 hours is better, overnight is the bomb.

If you have a chimney, use 3/4 of a stack.

If not, then pour your unlit coals into the grill and spread them out by hand into the shape they'll be in when you grill. In your case, they should all be on the left side with a clear spot on the right side. That is a great way to see how many coals you need.

Next, stack all the coals in the middle of the grill, try to get them in a pyramid shape. Squirt with lighter fluid, then light them. once they ash over, use long tongs to move the lit coals back to the left side (an oven mitt on your hand really helps with this part, but be careful - I've burned many an oven mitt in my day! :lol:). You can stack the lit coals a bit, but remember, at the end you will be grilling the chicken directly, so they need to be spread out a bit so you have some surface area to cook over.


Make sense?

I will most likely use your method and try Lee's at some point in the future.

I use 2 ov-gloves (sp). And I have used them to move lit coals and hot food without any utensils. They are great, don't feel any heat for short periods (I wouldn't suggest staying over fire for extended periods LOL) and wash great!!

So I need to add a little extra coals for a bed for the smoke box also right?


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