Air France Jet missing over Atlantic

[TexasGirl]

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/06/01/air.france.brazil/index.html

[Lefty]

I just saw that. Scarey how big the search area is. It doesn't look good.

[TexasGirl]

no, it doesn't. I just hope that it's found and not lost forever!

[Lefty]

226 miles off the coast is a long way out for a coordinated search.

[TexasGirl]

I know, I know, but, hope and dreams is all we have sometimes.

[Lefty]

I know, I know, but, hope and dreams is all we have sometimes.
I am hoping for the best. Miracles do happen.

[TexasGirl]

yeap, look at flight 1549....

[buzzard767]

Very little information released so far. I wonder what the final communications were about? If they were normal I always expect an explosion. Aviate, navigate, communicate.

[TexasGirl]

Maybe they will say more soon. I will keep looking at work.

[joec]

I have one question about air flight in general. Now I can go to Radio shack and buy a transponder for a few bucks so why isn't every air craft on the planet wired up with one. If for no other reason it would make it easier to find I would think. Lo jack has been around now for over a decade and works world wide.

[jim_slagle]

Lo jack has been around now for over a decade and works world wide.

Unless Lo Jack has drastically changed since I worked with them several years ago it won't work off shore. The radio signals are terrestrial based and only work to the horizon like the land based radar.

Jim

[joec]

Yes but the gadget I'm speaking off for example sold by radio shack it satellite based similar to a cell phone. As for Lo Jack I really don't know much about it but figured it was also a satellite based technology so I assumed wrong then. I used a sat nav system on my sail boat back in the early 80's.

[rickismom]

I thought planes were supposed to be grounded in lightning/thunderstorms...???

[Maverick2272]

Very little information released so far. I wonder what the final communications were about? If they were normal I always expect an explosion. Aviate, navigate, communicate.

I was wondering the same thing, was there anything in the communications that would indicate what happened? Lots of the questions asked here are the same ones I have, like can't they track the plane by the black box?

Another one, there is a map you can look at (I forget where it is) that shows where all the major passenger jets are at any given moment. IE a billion dots moving over a picture of the globe.
So, if they can do that and display it on the web, why can't they use similar technology to track and find this jet?

[buzzard767]

I have one question about air flight in general. Now I can go to Radio shack and buy a transponder for a few bucks so why isn't every air craft on the planet wired up with one. If for no other reason it would make it easier to find I would think. Lo jack has been around now for over a decade and works world wide.

Aircraft transponders have been around as long as I have. In the beginning it was identification only, then came altitude encoding in the late 60's. Now the transponders talk to other airplanes for collision avoidance as well. Great stuff.

I thought planes were supposed to be grounded in lightning/thunderstorms...???

On the ground you don't fuel during a thunderstorm. You don't take off or land with a near by thunderstorm because of wind shear, an event we knew was there but didn't fully understand until about 20 years ago. In the air, avoid thunderstorms like the plague. I've flown through two of them (military jets) and came out of the first one upside down and about 5000 feet higher than I entered it. Lightning strikes while airborne are generally no biggie because you aren't grounded. Once in a while small parts like antennas will get blown off the fuselage. I've been hit at least a hundred times and only incurred minor damage a couple of times. It keeps you awake though.... LOL

I was wondering the same thing, was there anything in the communications that would indicate what happened? Lots of the questions asked here are the same ones I have, like can't they track the plane by the black box?

Another one, there is a map you can look at (I forget where it is) that shows where all the major passenger jets are at any given moment. IE a billion dots moving over a picture of the globe.
So, if they can do that and display it on the web, why can't they use similar technology to track and find this jet?

They can.

[joec]

Aircraft transponders have been around as long as I have. In the beginning it was identification only, then came altitude encoding in the late 60's. Now the transponders talk to other airplanes for collision avoidance as well. Great stuff.

Then I ask again how do you lose an airplane even in the ocean at least the location of where it went down?

[Maverick2272]

I guess I am wondering the same thing here Joe. Seems scenarios like Lost and Castaway would be impossible these days with this kind of tracking around, and they should at least know where the jet is right now.

[Doc]

I'm sure no expert on this subject but my understanding was once they drop below a certain altitude the signal does not broadcast the same. Underwater would surely stop the signal from sending. Maybe a ship dangling a sensor in the water could pick it up but I doubt anything else can.

[joec]

Well like I said earlier Doc I had a 60' sail boat with a Sat Nav system. I could ping a satellite and it would tell me where I was on the planet with in a few yards. Subs also have the same system as that is what the system was originally designed for tracking them. It is also the basis for the cheap systems one can buy in Radio Shack for example. Now if it stopped working upon impact one should still know where it was when the transmission stopped sending. Now I know they make them that will give a constant echo so tracking a plane, ship or even a cell phone is available.

[smoke king]

So does anyone know if theres been any kind of update? I've been away from the TV all day.

[TexasGirl]

only what they keep putting up on cnn, Bob
http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/06/01/air.france.brazil/index.html

[Maverick2272]

Yea, basically they still don't know anything but fear the worst.

[smoke king]

Yea, basically they still don't know anything but fear the worst.

Probably a good a time as any to say a little prayer (for those who are so inclined) for these people and their families.

I've got to believe with all the technology available to us these days that when a big bird like this just vanishes, its almost certainly going to end badly.

That being said, I hope not.

[TexasGirl]

Wreckage found


http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/americas/06/02/brazil.france.plane.missing/index.html

[buzzard767]

This is the best information out there. You can try and read it good luck but the bottom line is that the mostly likely cause was airframe failure, probably the empannage (tail section).

http://www.weathergraphics.com/tim/af447/

The problem with Airbus design is their emphasis on building with composite materials that have sometimes been found to shatter under pressure.

It "looks" like the plane suffered enough turbulence to come apart.

Sad story. Now watch the politics in France as Airbus continues to blame the pitot static system instead of the real problem, one which would put them out of business.