Brisket question... oven or crock pot?

I have a brisket that is getting cooked tonight.
The recipe I found says brown it on all sides, then cook it in
liquid in the oven, covered, for 3 1/2 hours. It then gets another
40 minutes or so in a 375 degree oven.

All the crock pot recipes I see have cook times of 6-12 hours on low.

Why can't I do the brisket for 3 1/2 hours in my crock pot on high, and
then proceed with the rest of the recipe?
(On high, with a towel on the top, it gets to a good simmer...)

You can do it on high in your CP.

Depending on how long it takes your CP to come to a simmer, you'll have to adjust total time, but there's no reason why you can't do the brisket in the CP on high, then finish in the oven as your recipe calls for.

Technically, the liquid surrounding your brisket is going to limit the total heat to around 212 degrees, or a bit higher depending on how the components in your liquid affect the boiling point. At most, the BP will rise to around 220 or so. Since the liquid will keep the overall temps to around 220, it really doesn't matter if the heat source is the stove top, oven, or the CP.

In a covered roaster in the oven, even if you set the oven for 375, the liquid will never rise above the boiling point, and the resulting steam in the roaster will keep the air above the liquid (assuming standard air pressure) at just above the boiling point as well.

So, for submerging the brisket in liquid for braising, it won't matter what method/heat source (stove top, oven, or CP) you use.

Brisket is one of the toughest pieces of meat. It needs long slow cooking. Personally even in the oven I recommend a very long time, of course depending on how big the brisket is. 3 hours in the crock pot would not even scratch the surface of the brisket.
I usually make really big briskets, sometimes up to 20 pounds; I cook it all night, or all day on a low temp. Then it comes out very tender.

Keltin, my hazy remembrance of thermodynamics was that the liquid would stay near 212 regardless...glad to see I still retain a little knowledge too!
And Charlie, I was wondering about that as well..

Oh well, time will tell, as my Dad was fond of saying....

Kimchee said:

Keltin, my hazy remembrance of thermodynamics was that the liquid would stay near 212 regardless...glad to see I still retain a little knowledge too!
And Charlie, I was wondering about that as well..

Oh well, time will tell, as my Dad was fond of saying....

Click to expand...

A liquid's boiling point can be raised by adding a soluble substance to it. For water, adding a water soluble substance like salt or sugar raises the boiling point past 212. This is known as boiling point elevation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boiling-point_elevation

Also, increasing the air pressure such as in a pressure cooker, will raise the temperature above the open air boiling point.

I've had the best luck with briskets by doing 350° oven at about 25 min per pound. Cover with foil until the last half hour and don't remove all the fat. It must be cut across the grain or it is shoe leather if cut correct it will be fork tender. We have it about every other week in my house. Last but not least don't cook it to rare you want this cut of meat is better medium well to well done.

Some other notes is I put garlic slivers into the meat, I don't pre brown it. I also use unions slices below it and I don't trim off all of the fat cap. I sometimes will use a mushroom soup in the bottom as well.

I vote for oven but I've done it both ways with good results. In other words it's dealers choice!

brown that brisket very well and throw it in the CP... i have a tnt recipe on here and it takes a minimum of 8 hours just to slice..once the meat is up to 200* it will pull... but as joe said you have to slice it the right way

Beef Brisket Sandwiches w/bbq sauce

Kimchee said:

I have a brisket that is getting cooked tonight.
The recipe I found says brown it on all sides, then cook it in
liquid in the oven, covered, for 3 1/2 hours. It then gets another
40 minutes or so in a 375 degree oven.

All the crock pot recipes I see have cook times of 6-12 hours on low.

Why can't I do the brisket for 3 1/2 hours in my crock pot on high, and
then proceed with the rest of the recipe?
(On high, with a towel on the top, it gets to a good simmer...)

Click to expand...

Kimchee, how did your brisket turn out?

You can cook it all in the CP or in the oven. Or, you can remove some of the fat & brown it in a skillet, then put it in the cp. Re cook time - depends on your pot (new or older) & size of the meat. 6-12 hours is usually what the older CP cooking times were. No need to cook half in the cp & then in the oven - defeats the purpose of slow cooking in a CP. Never heard of putting a towel on top. Doesn't serve any purpose.

Next time, you might remove some of the fat, brown in a skillet if you wish, cut it up to fit in the cooker, if necessary, put the brisket in the cooker (stud w/ garlic if you wish), add beer, beef broth, chili sauce, onion/mushroom soup, if you like (& onions, potatoes, if there's room).

I check after about three hours. Remove it, let it rest before slicing.

(California Cook, I put a towel over my crock pot, which cuts the "achieve
boiling point" time by about half.)

This was OK. Nothing special, not too bad with the juices.
Makes a good mashed tater, brisket, juice on a potato roll sandwich!

The meat seemed dry to me. It was tender, and fall aparty at the edges, but was dry.

This is the recipe I followed, all I did different was cook it in the crock pot instead of the oven, and no parchment paper on top of the liquid, which pretty much filled the crock pot.
Then I did it in the oven as directed for 30 minutes.


Come to think of it, I might have sliced it the wrong way. Will check with the leftover chunk.

Ingredients
For the Brisket:

5 to 6 pounds point-cut beef brisket
Kosher salt and freshly ground pepper
3 to 4 tablespoons all-purpose flour
2 tablespoons extra-virgin olive oil
5 large Spanish onions, cut into thin wedges
8 cloves garlic, smashed
3/4 cup tomato paste
3 cups (1 bottle) full-bodied red wine
1 teaspoon sugar
4 leafy inner stalks celery
2 6-to-8-inch sprigs fresh rosemary
2 bay leaves
8 carrots, halved crosswise


For the Crust:
* 1 clove garlic, smashed
* Kosher salt
* 1 6-ounce piece fresh horseradish, peeled
* 1/2 cup roughly chopped fresh parsley
* 2 to 3 tablespoons dijon mustard

Directions
Prepare the brisket: Preheat the oven to 350 degrees. Generously season the brisket with salt and pepper, then coat with the flour in a large bowl. Heat the olive oil in a large Dutch oven or ovenproof pot over medium-high heat. Brown the brisket on all sides, about 10 minutes. Transfer the meat to a plate.
Add the onions and 2 teaspoons salt to the pot and cook, stirring, until soft, about 5 minutes. Add the garlic and cook, stirring, until the onions are caramelized, about 10 more minutes. Add the tomato paste and cook about 5 more minutes. Add the wine and 1 cup water, scraping up the browned bits from the bottom of the pot. Stir in the sugar. Reduce the heat to maintain a low simmer.
Tie the celery, rosemary and bay leaves together with kitchen twine and add to the pot along with the brisket and carrots. Cut a round of parchment paper to fit inside the pot; place directly on top of the liquid, then cover with the lid. Transfer to the oven and cook 3 hours, 30 minutes.

Meanwhile, make the crust: Mince and mash the garlic with 1 teaspoon salt. Coarsely grate the horseradish. Chop the parsley with the horseradish and garlic paste until the mixture is moist.
Remove the pot from the oven, discard the parchment and transfer the meat to a rimmed baking sheet. Increase the oven temperature to 375 degrees F. Brush the top of the brisket with the mustard, then pat with the horseradish mixture. Return the meat to the pot and bake, uncovered, until the crust is golden, 30 to 35 minutes.
Transfer the brisket to a cutting board. Discard the celery-herb bundle and skim the fat from the braising liquid; thin the remaining liquid with water, if desired. Slice the meat against the grain. Serve with the carrots, onions and braising liquid.

did you cut it perpendicular to the grain (across the grain)? If you cut it the other way, you would have ended up with long, stringy pieces.
I find that roasts cooked in the slow cooker, although surrounded by liquid, end up "dry." It seems all the good juices in the meat get simmered out.
I like to cook my brisket low and slow in the oven, with just a little bit of liquid.

My 7qt. Kitchen Aid crock-pot is the world's best. Takes no time at all to heat to desired temperature and has many settings other than low & high.

LOL! Mine is a darn near verifiable collectible model, circa the big hair days of the 1980s
I think. LOW and HIGH. That's it. NIce heavy crock though. Been hauling it around for years and rarely used it, so am trying things every now and then.

This is NOT a keeper recipe, LOL.

Even though it is surrounded by liquid the meat will be dry if it is allowed to boil. Keep the temperature below the boiling point and it will be moist. You want the internal temperature to be between 200 and 210 for the meat to be tender. That's the temperature when the tough connective tissue gelatinizes.

Leni said:

Even though it is surrounded by liquid the meat will be dry if it is allowed to boil. Keep the temperature below the boiling point and it will be moist.

Click to expand...

Now, see? The new crockpots are WAY hotter than the old ones (thanks a lot, "safe food police"!) Even on "Low", all my stuff boils eventually.

Drives me nuts!

I used to be able to put stuff in my old crock, go to work, get home 9 or so hours later and dinner would be perfect. Not any more. Stuff is done in 5 hours on low now.

So, Leni, NO simmering at all? Just very hot liquid?

Lee

I've actually dumped my slow cooker as the induction stove I recently purchased can do it for me on top. Simply put what you want, set the temperatures for how ever long then go. Once done you can even set it up for a warm mode. I've even gone back to making rice in a sauce pan on it as it is better than a dedicated rice steamer.

I would go at most with a very slow simmer. And yes, thanks to the food police it is impossible to get a crock pot that doesn't boil. I just bought an Oster that is not supposed to boil. We'll see. If it does it goes right back to the store.

Leni said:

I would go at most with a very slow simmer. And yes, thanks to the food police it is impossible to get a crock pot that doesn't boil. I just bought an Oster that is not supposed to boil. We'll see. If it does it goes right back to the store.

Click to expand...

I have found that all the crock pots I've owned, even set on low, do boil eventually..even if it's a slow boil... it's still a steady boil.
Left unattended, they are nothing like they used to be, as Lee stated...grrrrr

QSis said:

Now, see? The new crockpots are WAY hotter than the old ones (thanks a lot, "safe food police"!) Even on "Low", all my stuff boils eventually.

Drives me nuts!

I used to be able to put stuff in my old crock, go to work, get home 9 or so hours later and dinner would be perfect. Not any more. Stuff is done in 5 hours on low now.

So, Leni, NO simmering at all? Just very hot liquid?

Lee

Click to expand...

My "Beef" exactly ! My latest Crock is calibrated so high that I can almost cook on the "Warm" setting............ As Leni said, on low all day still brings the boil, and the cut is dried out by 5:00...........
Now-a-days, it's the oven, with Joe C's instructions ...........

Perfect every time !!










http://netcookingtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14219&highlight=MARINATED+BARBECUE+BEEF+BRISKET

Ah... My towel on the top is causing too much of a boil, I should just let it do its thing.

Cool, thanks!!!!

I do mine in the oven. Sits on sliced onions. i cover with chili sauce and a can of beer. Cook it at 325 for a long time as others have said.

The only brisket I have ever cooked is corned beef brisket. I don't use a crock pot. I just simmer it on top of the stove. All recipes I see say NOT to boil. The water should barely ripple if you want a tender juicy finish. I am hoping to get a pressure cooker (my first one) and try a brisket.